Elon Musk x Tucker Carlson Full Interview - "This Could Be The Last Election"
Questions on ElonsFAQ asked in this interview (7)
Transcript
0:00if he loses man [Laughter] what you're [ __ ] dude I'm [ __ ] if he loses I'm [ __ ] it does seem that way you can't just be like you can't just be like yeah
0:15I'm like how how long do you think my prison sentence is going to be you think will I see my children I don't know cuz it's not like you can say well yeah I maxed out to them but you know I get you're no deniability
0:30no no and I've been trashing Kamala non-stop oh I know well not I'm the Kamala puppet I call her you know the the the machine that the K puppet represents yeah she's irrelevant I mean she's not even no no like like I made I made a joke which I
0:46realized I deleted um which is like nobody's even bothering to try to kill Kamala because it's pointless what do you achieve nothing another puppet exactly that's it's no point in deep and true though nobody's tried to kill Joe Biden
1:02it's be pointless totally you actually put that up yeah now some people interpret it as I was as as though I was calling for people to to assassinate her but I'm but but I was like but I was like nobody even you know
1:18you like doesn't seem strange that no one's even bothered to try it's not worth it I mean there's an endless supply yeah like nobody would it's absurd could be anybody yeah yeah you nobody's going to try to nobody
1:34tries to assassinate a puppet of course not um a marionette yeah a marionette it's just like you know it's hilarious she's safe like I I like to try to kill Trump twice with actual guns
1:49and bullets um oh yeah shut in the air right in [ __ ] but Butler where I was and uh he doesn't seem rattled it's weird does he do you it doesn't seem what rattled uh he I mean he a constitution
2:04of an ox it seems um you know it's not like working out and eating healthy and he's okay we got to tape this oh yeah we're good oh good yeah so so he's not like let me eat another
2:19salad that's not no or or work out you know you know fastidiously that's he he I feel like he doesn't work out and he it's you know know cheeseburg and D Coke and stuff and it just I think it just
2:34inherently has a strong Constitution so when you I mean you were just with him he didn't seem like a man who'd been the subject of two assassination attempts no he seemed uh of you know sound mind and body and uh strong
2:51backbone did you um I mean that's what I said in the thing and the remarks I made there were impromptu there's no teleprompt or anything I just I was just I was speaking extemporaneously are you the only rich guy who doesn't have like a media
3:06consultant no me consulted yeah no I've noticed obviously yeah yeah oh I mean no I I just um no I just thought about what what what I want to say and I just spoke with the cuff uh no tele promp to nothing good for you yeah I could talk
3:24just look like like like now I'm just talking look at me wow amazing can believe it I can talk without a do promto that's crazy but if if he loses it's going to be hard for you to pretend you never supported
3:42him all in all in in the deep end yeah no you are definitely in the deep end you cannot touch bottom no no I'm I'm like I'm like rolling around I'm like a picking M I'm
3:57like it's all in baby is it fun yeah it's pretty fun how I mean I mean there may be some in the hopefully unlikely event that he loses there may be some Vengeance uh on me were you kidding I I mean it's possible it's
4:15possible you've got to be one of the biggest government contractors we do essential work with the government yes yeah it's not like you know uh we we do useful essential work right um that we compete for and
4:31win contracts on because our product is much better and costs less that that's why we get comp no and and and I mean if you take for example the um the NASA contract to transport astronauts to in from the space station
4:47uh Boeing got NASA ordered two contracts at the start uh one to Boeing and one to SpaceX boing was awarded twice as much as SpaceX SpaceX has done all the Astron transport uh from the space station and and Boeing
5:03has only done one one transport of one of two astres to the space station and we have to bring them back B got twice as much as SpaceX there there's this a total misunderstanding that that my companies have been subsidized and supported by
5:19the government and get all these and and it's like do you do you really think that a Biden Administration is going to subsidize me probably not you kidding no in fact uh they take away every contract they possibly can uh so
5:36there for example there was the FC the the FCC contract to uh $42 billion for uh providing providing rural rural Bo Broadband yes okay uh we we actually first said look we don't we think there
5:51shouldn't be any subsidies so we recommend this that this program just not exist um but since you're insisting that it ex that it exists we will compete um and we we have better product so we we we won I don't know about a quarter of it um which would have
6:06included the devastated areas like North Carolina and stuff and um the FCC took it away illegally they just voted three out of five Commissioners voted away and said even though you want it we're we're we're sending it on what ground and do
6:22you know how many people they' have connected how many zero so you think that was political well the three Democrats voted against it and the two Republicans voted for it so you tried to get starlink you tried
6:37to get Starling into North Carolina into Western North Carolina the area is devastated by the hurricane we have got it is it is in there and it is the primary means of communication in the devastated areas you had conflict with Buddha judge
6:52over this well I I I raised a cons I said look we're we we had delivered we've beened bring starlink terminals there for a while and obviously some people already had them um since they just you know consum private individuals had starlink there already um we
7:08delivered uh um really thousands of terminals U and and got all the way up to the you know the areas where they wouldn't let us go any further and then we're like okay we're going to send helicopters in uh and and and find people who are stranded and and give
7:23them Starling terminals which I think is you know and Ice think yeah okay the they they wouldn't let us land um because the there was an FAA uh notice to M and notem that said in order to
7:39land you have to know who you're going to meet with uh to land now the problem is we're trying to deliver internet communications people don't have internet communications we don't know who they are then they can't reach us because they are don't have communications do you see the cash 22
7:54yes I do Insane so so it's obviously impossible for people who don't have internet communications to let us to to let us know who they are because they don't have the internet yes yes and so um did
8:11you explain this to the federal government yes what they say they they they they fixed it how was Buddha judge when you talked to him he was actually good so I want to be just yeah I want to give Buddha judge some credit here um first a you know when I complained about
8:26it he he he reacted in in a in a very level-headed way and he reached out to me and he called me yeah uh and we we discussed the issue got to the bottom of it and he fixed it good so credit to vo judge yeah well and to you for pushing it yeah I mean so but as soon as he was
8:43aware of the problem he fixed it well you publicized it too on yeah yeah as soon as you shamed him well but I do want to give credit words too yeah no amen I agree completely so but back to the original question you know about the potential
8:59consequence ques if you know having gone all in this doesn't work yeah um I mean you had to have thought about this long and hard before you did it what was your thinking I mean yeah
9:22so I mean my view is is that if Trump doesn't win this election it's the last election we're going to have um that uh the Democrats the Dem machine um has been uh importing so many PE bringing in
9:39so many illegals flying flying in with this like CVP border app thing that nobody even knew about like secret program that's illegal basically it's it's illegal but there's no action by doj to actually to to stop it from happening
9:54they're um transporting uh large numbers of of illegals to swing States um if you look at the numbers these are the numbers from the government website so like from the Dem
10:09Democrat administered government websites like where do you get this data from the government website that is run by democrats um and uh there are triple digit increases in illegals to all the swing States and in some cases it's like 700% over the last 3 years now these
10:26swing state marins are you know sometimes 10 20,000 votes so what happens if you put you know hundreds of thousands of people into each swing state uh and and and and for the for the if when somebody has granted Asylum they
10:42are fast-tracked they they they they get can get a green card and then five years after the Green Card uh they can get they can get citizenship and they can fully legally vote and when they do so they vote overwhelmingly Democrat and the and
10:58sometimes I get the bottle of like well a lot of them their social values don't align with sort of the far-left sort of work ideology I said that's true but um but that's not their top priority the their top priority is getting their friends and family also to the United States uh and the the Dems also issue
11:15all these programs these sort of handouts essentially that make them beholden to the Democratic party so they vote them that's what happens so my prediction is if there's another four years Dem Administration they will
11:31legalize so many uh illegals that are there uh that the next election there won't be any swing States and and will be a single party country just like California is a single party State it's a super majority Dam
11:46State in California because of immigration yes the California was uh fairly reliably Republican um Bill Clinton lost California in 92 and won West Virginia yes um so there was a 9 986 amnesty yes
12:06um at and and um thereafter California trended very strongly Dem and is at this point uh I think 65 70% Dem something like that it's super majority Dem the like the
12:21California legislature yes is more than two-third Democrat um has it improved the state no it's it's not um and they they California just passed which is shocking it's hard to believe this even this is even real but californ just passed the
12:37law making it illegal uh to require vo or ID in any election at all in California you know that no yeah Newsome signed it into law last week it's illegal to require an ID in any election
12:53even a Town Council and a friend of mine who is this can lives in paloalto was like was like is this actually real and he went to like vote in like some City Council election he tried to show them his ID
13:09and they said we're not even allowed to look at your ID have they extended the same actually what's going on right now by way they're proud of it they're not hiding it only voting it's not buying a gun or buying liquor buying a pack of cigarettes or
13:24flying on an airplane or rening a hotel room it's only voting that it's illegal if you try to buy a gun I mean they're going to ID you six ways a Sunday uh yeah they try California is trying to make it basically legal to so and a
13:39gun um um and and the same people that demanded vaccine IDs for if you want to travel or do anything are the same ones who say no voter ID is required is there any reason hypocritical to pass a law like that except to a bet voter
13:54fraud um it's it's for it's it's it's so that fraud can never cannot be proven so it it it enables large scale fraud and no way to prove it because how would you prove it it's literally impossible no no ID you're not even allowed to show
14:09your ID it's insane well it is insane insane um so yeah um the the purpose of no V voter ID is
14:25obviously to conduct fraud in elections obviously there can be no other explanation I mean they come up with some nice sounding thing um people don't have IDs could you live in this country without an ID yeah I mean their common
14:40rebuttal is like it's racist to require ID and which is insane I think it's actually RAC racist and patronizing to say that people can't figure out how to get ID obviously but how could you live here without an ID I don't think yeah you can't do anything yeah you need an Ida
14:58for everything like the list of things Union ID for is basically everything um except voting so so you see the rest of the country it's total [ __ ] obviously come obviously
15:13yes but that doesn't in any way minimize the aggression or self-righteousness they bring to this conversation yes it's you're a racist if you want that right where where in fact obviously someone is racist if they say that uh people have particular race
15:29cannot get ID that's patronizing and racist that's absurd yes yeah you know it's like when a governor of New York said people in the you know ghetto don't know how to use computers or something like that I mean like you know super out of
15:44touch for sure yeah so it's like H so there's a really clear template she doesn't know how to use computers but they do obviously I don't think Hoku could use a computer yeah I don't think she qualified
15:59intellectually yeah no probably not but not everyone in New York is as dumb as as Kathy hok I think that's true yeah um so you see the other 49 states becoming California if the machine wins well you don't need uh all all 49 to go that way
16:15you just need you know enough to have the election have they not be swing States I mean there are only six Swing Swing States yep so there only six states out of 50 right now that are in contention so if those six states that
16:30are in contention uh by narrow margins are no longer in contention then uh the the only contest will be who wins the Democratic Prim primary that's how it is in California that's how it is in New
16:45York there there's no there's no party uh party versus party situation the only contest is who wins the Democratic Prim primary and as we've seen with the um uh appointment of kamla who no one voted
17:01for even in a Democratic primary yes where's the Democracy here which is it's easier though I mean it's just the Dem party Elite just decides who who who is in charge that's that that that that's that's a you know
17:17a tiny oligarchy basically comprised of that's not democracy the richest people in the country that's kind of the interesting part to me is that the richest people in the country are on board with this I mean that's what it is it's the it's it's a collection of billionaires most of them are yeah but
17:32you're not not me and not everyone is I think there's but but it it is a a shocking number of So-Cal billionaires are uh in the damn Camp more than are in the Republican Camp oh for sure which is wild so the in fact the astonishing
17:50thing in the swing States is that that it's that they're even a contest given that uh the the Dems have far more money than the Republicans so so the K C dramatically outspends the Trump campaign in the swing States um the uh
18:09overwhelming the the media is overwhelmingly pro- Democrat so you got you know the the Press you know is is a a damn cheering Squad um and um you know so oh and then and then you've got Al
18:25all all the almost all the Hollywood and entertainment the celebr also you know endorsing Comm and being proem so so you got so you got the celebrities you got the they got the money uh they got um got basically
18:40everything on the side of the dams the the problem is the underdog here Trump's Underdog in swing Wing States and still it's a contentious it's still a 50/50 after all that what does that tell you it tells me that if if if people actually knew what was going on they
18:55weren't being fed non-stop propaganda it would be a landslide in favor of of Republicans yeah well how's this for crazy has there ever been a more volatile time in American politics not in our lifetimes No One Alive has ever seen anything like this but long before
19:11things started to really fall apart the Heritage Foundation saw it coming heritages pulled together a coalition of over a hundred right-leaning groups to develop a comprehensive plan for day one that would include detailed policy proposals on the most pressing issues the big ones securing the Border
19:27controlling inflation cracking down on Election fraud protecting the rights of the individual and saving the nation from being crushed by woke anti-human ideology the team of Heritage has also developed a plan to dismantle the Deep state that keeps this nonsense going and
19:43reclaim this nation from the small group of technocrats that's broken everything Herer is also running a training and vetting program to identify effective conservatives to serve in the next Presidential Administration people who will share your values this country's
19:59values and actually do the job it can't just be the same pool of discredited people from Washington populating every Administration herriage has a Long Head Start and they put in a lot of work already but they need your support to finish the job and to support the
20:14incoming president you can go to heritage.org Tucker and contribute to this important work today a lot depends on it heritage.org Tucker but why not join the easier side I mean you're just you're creating
20:30problems for yourself by getting on stage with Trump and I mean you must have had friends who said that to you sure yes yeah people care about you like why even get involved in this well I get because I I I think we
20:46want to remain a democracy and we don't want to become a onep party State yes that's the reason um and the it's the exact opposite like the people call Trump a threat to democracy and the people who are saying Trump's the threat to democracy are themselves the threat
21:02to democracy yes um one party rule is not democracy uh one party where essentially the party Elite pick a candidate as happened with Kamala is not democracy where did the people vote show me where the people voted no there were no people voting it was all just D party
21:18Elite that just appointed someone um and and and when the when the Biden puppet uh when the pro Biden puppets uh ratings sagged they knifed him in the back immediately and just tossed him out and put a put a new
21:34puppet on that's exactly what happened tell me I'm wrong well n Only you're right I mean it's almost not even worth criticizing KLA Harris exactly what does she have to do with it there's no point in criticizing she she's she's simply the the face of a large a much larger
21:49machine yes um and she will say whatever is whatever the T the telepromter whatever's on the teleprompter she's going to say it yes now she gets stuck if the teleprompter breaks that happened recently I think the de promp sto and she just she was just like looping for a
22:04while for about a minute um so I think it happened yesterday or something it was pretty funny to watch um but she'll just say whatever words are on the teleprompter so you know um it's really whoever
22:21controls the teleprompter is the actual sort of those that's who's actually in charge and who is that do you think well I've tried to put it down it's it's it's not like any one kind of Mastermind it's not like it seems to be it's like um Kamala sort of a a marionette
22:38with you know th a thousand Puppet Masters type of thing like not it's it's it's or maybe it's in it's it's somewhere north of a 100 is what it seems like yes um I bet you know 80 of them I probably know most of them yeah
22:56yeah so what I mean just by virtue of your job and what you've been doing for the last 30 years I mean you um and I should say I think you voted for I'd like to see a matchup of of of those qu the the top 100 Puppet Masters on the FD Client
23:13List do you think there's some overlap strong overlap strong overlap when are we going to see that list do you think I don't know it's it's it's it's mind-blowing that that it um that they've not tried to prosecute even one not even the wor offender on on the F
23:30Client List they have not even tried to prosecute even one is that that's insane well because they have a lot of diabetic grandmothers who were outside the capital on January 6th they they're kind of occupied yeah I mean they've put like whatever five or 600 January 6
23:46protesters in prison and not one person on on the F Client List will that ever come out do you think you know I think part of why Kamala is getting so much support is that uh if if Trump wins that FC and
24:01Client List is going to become public yes and some of those billionaires behind Kam are terrified of that outcome yeah do you think Reed Hoffman's uncomfortable yes yeah and Gates and Gates yeah and I only ask that because
24:18you can sort you just look at them and you're like that that's a nervous person right there I don't know I mean I assume you know them yeah yes uh Reed hoffen was my vice president of Business Development at PayPal 24 years ago um he does he seem nervous to
24:38you yeah I mean he's terrified of a trump Victory because of the disclosure that would follow I think yeah I mean I think he's certainly ideologically not aligned with Trump anyway but I think he
24:53is concerned about the uh the FC situation like something might actually the doj might actually move forward there are a lot of videos apparently those rooms on the island and I think out in New Mexico were wired for
25:08video right and where's the video I mean between ddy and Epstein uh it's go there there's probably several thousand hours of footage here yeah yeah it's kind of weird that the people on those videos are lecturing the rest of us but our moral failings isn't it yeah it is weird
25:25what is that um well I mean part of how they deflect attention from themselves is by you know criticizing the morals of others yes so they it's sort of like a preemptive moral strike U
25:40yes I mean as I said I think those who are saying Trump is a threat to democracy are themselves actually the threat to democracy it feels like we're getting to a place where the rest of us know too much is this you know what I mean I mean
25:55it's it's it's easier to live in a society where you don't really know what the people in charge of doing or why they're doing it but now thanks I would say largely to X yeah um I think that's fair to say that yeah uh we we do know a lot not everything but we know a lot and I wonder where does that like what
26:10happens next now that we know all this the kidnapper shown us his face like what happens well I think if uh if Trump wins we can do some house cleaning and shed light on
26:26things you all all the X platform does is uh adhere to freedom freedom of speech within the bounds of the law yes and if if people want to change the laws they they can change the laws and so like X in different countries we X does
26:42censor in in in countries where censorship is is is the law um we don't try to you know P push American laws in other countries uh but we do try to stick to the law in any given country um that's what we're doing um uh we open
26:57source our algorithm uh we try to be as transparent as possible um uh but uh those who want to push lies obviously hate truth and transparency yes because it shows them to be Liars I mean you look at that like how
27:14outrageous it was that um kamla in the presidential debate kept kept pushing the fine people hoax they know the fine people hoax is false Trump would never support Nazis Nazi R
27:29it's absurd and he explicitly said that you in that same speech uh that you must condemn not you know anyone uh who who has Nazi Tendencies with the uh in the strongest possible terms um and
27:44yet despite knowing that to be false uh the people who who who wrote the speech for the Kam puppet uh put the fine people hoax in a presidential debate deliberately lying
28:01again mess up if she wins I mean I how can they let X continue uh in its current form in its current role in American society they they won't they will uh try to shut it
28:16down by any means possible what do you mean by any means possible I mean with e either by I mean they'll try to pass laws uh they'll try to prosecute the company prosecute me um
28:32any I mean the amount of lawfare that we've seen taking place is is outrageous um I mean the I mean there many examples but like the Department of Justice For example launched a huge lawsuit against SpaceX
28:47for failing to hire Asylum Seekers come on Asylum Seekers Asylum not Asylum those who been granted Asylum Asylum Seekers now this now there's also a law uh called International traffic and arms regulations um that because
29:04SpaceX uh develops Advanced missile technology that can be used in in nuclear icbms um that we H we have to be very careful with who we hire we can only hire someone if they were a permanent resident or citizen that's what the itar law says then there's another law that
29:20says that uh you cannot discriminate against Asylum Seekers so we're downed if you do down if you don't that doj did a massive lawsuit against SpaceX uh for failing to hire Asylum Seekers even though we are it it is
29:36legal for us to H hire ass seers under itar law this actual thing that that that's that's going on um and they can only they can only do a fairly small number of lawsuits
29:51every year so for why did they pick this one because you X yeah lawfare I mean or it's like that famous quote from barrier you know the yeah Stalin's Like Chief torturer and head of the
30:07secret police of Baria said show me the man and I'll show you the crime exactly I mean we have so many laws that it is actually impossible to ex you know impossible to to do business impossible to operate without
30:25um being uh violating some law because you have laws like it the ones I just G gave you where where both things are illegal yes they contradict one another they contradict one another um so you know it's it's illegal
30:40to discriminate against like discriminate against syum seekers in in jobs but it's also legal for us to hire sence Seekers but it Des they just they just chose one they chose the the the the one law and ignored the other one and the
30:56department of J Justice at Federal level prosecutor basx for that what do you think it's mad well it also discredits the idea of law which some of us want to take seriously absolutely it it it this affects both
31:12the perception of of American Justice and the reality of it yes um so no I'm actually a big fan of the American justice system and I think on balance uh
31:28you know we we've got still still have an excellent Judicial System we still have judges that care about the letter uh an intent of the law I mean not just the letter but also the intent of the law um but something that people should be concerned about is that there's an
31:43increasing movement to place activists as judges this is uh if you look at who who did the Biden Administration confirm as federal judges and who are
31:58been confirmed at at the state level in in in in sort of far States increasingly it is it is not uh judges who uh care about Justice or or they they don't care about following the law they care about
32:15social justice not justice justice right what they call social social justice activists as judges now you got a real problem do you think if if that continues we we will not have a real
32:31justice system or a real country yes yeah um but again your purchase of X has been I think it's fair to say even if I hated it I would say this because it's true it's been pivotal in American politics yeah um in an American
32:47society uh do you think they could shut you down if the Democrats continue to hold power they'll unequivocally try yeah yeah and and if if if they if
33:03they uh if they get a majority in the Senate and House um and the presidency then they can simply pass a law uh and delete section 230 so simply make us liable for what for what any what anyone says on a
33:20platform with uh you know go like at this point almost 600 million monthly active users yeah which is impossible how you know that's that's like trying to regulate speech in city of like a country uh so a big country yeah just be
33:37instantly bankrupt but I bet they wouldn't withdraw legal immunity from the vaccine makers at the same time would they no that's unlikely just I mean as long as we're withdrawing legal liability
33:52protection yeah yeah I mean the whole vaccine debate is is is a long one um you you know I'm I'm not actually I'm not antivaccine in general um I think we want to exercise caution with use of vaccines but um in the absence of vaccines uh there would be a lot more I
34:09think people that that uh that have died you know like we want the small pox vaccine that was a good one it seems a good one yeah yeah yeah small pox will kill you killed a lot of people it killed a lot of people it used to be people would like a lot of people would
34:25die of small pox and a lot of people would get polio for sure yeah we had a presid who had a polio oh yeah there's still people you meet people today yeah in their 80s who limping from childhood polio right it's good that we don't have that and vaccines you know played a major role in
34:42that so that doesn't mean that vaccines should not have any scrutiny of course they should we should be making sure that the quality control on vaccines is incredibly good if we're giving them to children and whatnot um and we shouldn't we shouldn't force people to take vaccines
35:00um that itself is a controversial statement that we shouldn't force people we shouldn't force people take vaccines now yeah um so just to Rea I believe in Freedom like uh yeah I've noticed like uh you know America is supposed to be
35:17the land of liberty um you know uh freedom freedom and opportunity uh so that uh we try to as much as possible maximize people's individual um and that we try to be a country where you succeed based on uh your talent and
35:34hard work yes uh those are two fundamental values um that that's what that's that's what's made America great and and if we lose those we will our decline will be swift um what what do you if you had to
35:52get if you had to bet I mean does Freedom reassert itself in America or
36:07not well that's why I think part of why this election is so pivotal I think if we with a trump Administration I think we can improve the liberty of Americans um we we can
36:22uh I think we need to have sensible deregulation uh where we we keep the regulations that matter like we don't want to destroy you know important habitats or yes you know encourage oil spills or anything like that um but there there are so many
36:39regulatory agencies that have overlapping responsibility um that we are smothering progress and we can't build a highspeed rail in America you look at the ridiculous High-Speed Rail Project in California where they've spent $7 billion and all they've got to show for
36:54it is a six a600t section of concrete with no rails on it there a picture of it online so it's not it's not that fast yet we wouldn't say it's highp speed at this point or even rail it doesn't even have rail on it maybe by now they put some rail in it but it's this comically
37:09small section of rail uh $7 billion has been spent uh most of it in in like environmental Consulting and uh I don't know where it's but clearly not in building highspeed rail uh so we can't we can't we've got there are so many
37:26different regulatory agencies and so many laws and regulations that prevent progress that if this continues we simply won't be able to get anything done it does seem like the engineers are not getting rich it's the environmental
37:41Consultants the climate Consultants the Dei Consultants a whole consultant class seems to be getting richer by the year where people with actual skills the ones that bring actual progress useful things products and services that you use that's right so this is things that if
37:56you were like tra on a desert island you'd want those people right right um but you wouldn't want environmental Consultants they seem under they seem under you're going to starve okay yeah yeah yeah and um it's like who who's who are actual Builders at that get things done um and uh you know and and and and
38:15every year we're making it harder in America for actual Builders to get things done you know we're in this like weird Anand Atlas Shrugged scenario where it's you know there's yet regulation yet another Rule and the sort
38:30of that that phrase in Atlas Shug oh you'll oh you'll manage oh you'll manage oh you'll manage it's like eventually you like can't get anything done why the hostility though toward people with with meaningful skills it's it's not it's not a neutral posture they have and they're enriching themselves obviously by
38:46creating fake jobs because they have no skills and you know they don't have creative power so I understand that but why do they hate people who do have creative power and actual skills I don't understand that
39:04I don't I'm not sure I understand it either because it's difficult for me to put put myself in the mindset um because I'm someone who believes in construction I I build things that's what I do I build cars I build Rockets I build inter you know satellite internet
39:19um you know I've spent um thousands of hours tens of thousands of hours in in factories building up factories um so you know I also I I can't really put
39:34myself in the mind of say someone who would want to do crime because I don't want to do crime yeah you know I don't want to hurt you know there there's some people who who enjoy hurting other people I don't enjoy hurting other people um so I have a hard time imagining why would somebody do that yes
39:50you know in an extreme case you you can't put yourself in the mind of like say a Jeffrey dma where where you're like a cannibalistic serial killer because you're not a cannibalistic serial killer right you're like I can't I don't get it you know it's not a fetish you can really
40:06to you know um I do think this is that in the sort of well-meaning sort of liberal mindset I know I've have many good friends who have you they're very have deep empathy
40:21for their fellow human beings good and they they they care um and and and but the challenge that they have is is that they've often grown up in a very sheltered existence where everyone around them is nice and civilized and they just really don't encounter people
40:36who are um have have uh uncontrolled violent tendencies uh or or like hurting people you know they've just always grown up in a sort of Kumbaya everyone is nice uh ify commun situation um
40:54Minneapolis pre- riots yeah yeah I mean if you if you if yeah but but there's there's a small number of people it's like a few perc of society that um either can't have anger management
41:09issues that are so severe that they they they lose their temper and hurt or murder others um and there's as very as small as like I it's not not a large number that that enjoy hurting other people and if you do not incarcerate them they will they will do that to they
41:26will they will hurt other people um and what I see is is what I call um shallow empathy like people have empathy for the criminals but not empathy for the victims of the criminals yes and so if you simply have and I
41:43believe one should have deep empathy to say like what is the greater good for society um is it better to incarcerate Violent criminals and prevent them from hurting people or to let them loose and allow those people to be hurt and I think the latter is much worse you know my mom is my mom lives in New
42:00York and and it's my mom at this at this point is has gone from being Democrat to Republican and her her friends in New York uh are sh having the same experience because you know what'll turn you from a
42:15Democrat to a republican pretty fast is getting punched in the face while you walk down the street yes which for no reason yes and then and then and then no action being taken against those who hurt you and that happened to your mom not not to my mother but to three of her
42:31friends this year hey it's Tucker Carlson I am not in the studio I'm in the and you can hear it in the audio probably I'm in the back of an SUV outside a hotel in Tulsa Oklahoma I think it's Tulsa okom anyway we're on the road for this monthlong tour and
42:47there is a lot going on in the world and the question is how do you understand what's happening there are deeper Trends unfolding you probably sense that and it would be helpful to have some grounding in exactly what they are and if you're like me and you spent four years in
43:02college and didn't learn all that much where do you go to understand what's happening to your world well Hillsdale College in our opinion is one of the very few places left in the english- speaking world where your kids can get a real education but not just your kids
43:17you they have free online classes completely free you can get them anywhere including in the back seat of an SUV outside a hotel in Tulsa Oklahoma and you'll know that when you go there go to Tucker forh hillsdale.com and they have an amazing new course called
43:33Marxism socialism and communism Hillsdale is offering it doesn't cost you a dime and you can pull it up right on your phone if you want go to Tucker for hillsdale.com and the class Marxism socialism and communism and you'll have a much better understanding of what
43:49you're watching every day why would someone punch them in the face I don't know but that's I'm not a face puncher right you know but if you walk around the Streets of San Francisco and many downtown so
44:05they go go to downtown Philadelphia right now you know they call people homeless but but the homeless is the wrong term violent drug zombie yeah [Laughter] okay it's like you know you look at them you say like homeless is a misnomer it
44:22implies that someone got a little behind on their mortgage and if you just offer them a job they'd be back on their feet yeah now but if if if you go and look at downtown Philly or or San Francisco or parts of New York and actually most most downtown you what you actually have are violent drug zombies so they're like
44:38shuffling down the street with dead eyes you know and and and and and with like needles you know on the and human feces on the streets I me you've been to downtown SF right have you seen this oh I was born there yeah yeah yeah like one of the
44:54most beautiful cities in the world oh yes the greatest now you have to step over the the drug needles and the feces and the bodies like one one couple I met the final Stoll for leaving San Francisco was there was a they came home uh one night and there was dead
45:10body in front of their garage they could could get their car in to could park their car the corpse yeah there's no street parking they're like there's a corpse there's a corpse in front of the garage and they don't want to move the corps you know cuzz like well you know you know you're like maybe there they
45:26need to like figure why the guy died or something you know that's the that's liberal compassion though they're in a bit of a quandry because they they got no place park a car and they they feel that they shouldn't really move the dead body so they cool 911 and I said there's a dead
45:43body out outside our house um and um they said well said the one San Francisco says well are you in danger right now it's like well no he's dead he's pretty sure he's dead um and um
46:01they're like they're like okay we we'll send someone tomorrow to pick up the body like they'll R me tomorrow so so they like going in another house while there's a dead
46:16body in front D in front of their house you know and like it like took him like 24 hours or something like that to eventually pick up the body and they're like this H with this we're leaving um and did they yes by way there's a million anecdotes
46:32like that oh I know I know but I just don't think this is not rare it's well it's it's it's ubiquitous and so then you wonder like how can people still tell themselves they're compassionate this what I'm saying is that is that people really just need to think what
46:47like I believe in being compassionate about I believe in that we should care about our fellow human beings um I think this is a good thing of course should not be we should not be selfish and not care about others we should care about others but we should just care about others All Things Considered uh like I
47:04said care not me just about the criminals it's just one layer deep um you should also care about the criminals victims yes yes well especially the criminals victims yes innocent people who get attacked and killed so I mean I got so many anec I mean um you know like
47:22uh uh about a year ago there were there were three uh ex or or Twitter employees who were just um leaving the building walking down mock Street in in San Francisco Mo Street used to be beautiful wonderful Street obviously it's called
47:37Market Street cuz that's where the market was right now now it's sported up shop windows and stuff and uh and um they were chased by a guy with an axe who wanted they they outran him and they reported hey there's a guy
47:53with an axe who who try to try to kill us with an axe the police did nothing um and uh that guy with an ax subsequently murdered two people with an
48:08axe with the with the axe because eventually he's going to find somebody he can outr run and he did so what I'm saying is if you if you don't stop ax motor while while they're attempting to ax motor eventually they will succeed in
48:24ax motoring people if this goes on I mean that's such an obvious observation it seems obvious yes I think it is yeah that if you're in any way a betting Axe Murder then you're really you're against civilization
48:40that's the way it looks to me I mean yeah I don't see I'm trying to understand motive here I can't relate like you but you're against the whole project if you're allowing that I guess is what I'm saying yeah I think we should um controversial position but I think we should arrest axim motoras when
48:56first attempt to ax murder not after they've succeeded in doing so and I think we should assigned at least some of the blame for the Axe Murders to the people who allowed allowed this guy to WAND around with an axe on Market Street trying to kill people yes yeah well you know this
49:11this whole movement to decriminalize Crime oh I've noticed yes what is that um Madness yeah uh like to make crime crime legal like in California you can just steal things and nobody does
49:26anything um it's like fully legal to steal anything under $1,000 in California that's why they've got they now have to like lock up Goods Behind These like you know glass and plastic walls so you go to the supermarket and you can't even get like what toothpaste um so and and
49:45this has actually been particularly difficult on small mom and pop operations because they don't have the resources of a large corporation so it's put a lot of small businesses out of just killed them so when you're at dinner parties and you make these points what do people say well actually I think I've been I've
50:02been able to persuade people that yeah we we we really um we need to reverse course here I think I have actually been able to persuade a number of people and I think there actually is a now a ballot on a California ballot initiative to Rec Rec
50:19criminalize uh theft theft know right guys guys we there's a reason why we crimin St in the first place um so so and then amazingly I think Gavin new was came out against
50:35that uh proposition yeah no honestly he's the goddamn Joker Gavin yome is like if it's like like from the like Batman Dark Knight The Joker is in charge of Gotham you remember like when he took over New York basically
50:51um and and and and the criminals Ram free and the citizens are arrested that's how that's California but but I mean at least there's a ballot initiative which I think will probably pass to say no actually it is a crime to steal things because people so you know Gavin
51:08you've got to know Gavin Newsome he knows I know Gavin Newsome you know everyone knows I've known Gavin for a long time exactly so what is that and he doesn't seem crazy when you talk to him in person he's a perfectly nice guy like what why would he and he's not stupid why would he come out in favor of
51:25crime well his stated recently was that it would disproportionately affect uh uh people of color yeah well again that was his public statement right well that is one of those patronizing racist positions you described at the outset obviously yeah I mean he's literally saying uh
51:41black people are Hispanic criminals yeah of course yeah yeah um no that's what he's saying that's what he's saying yeah yeah and by the way it is true that crime like that does increase distrust between races it actually gives rise to racism it's totally destructive of the
51:57social fabric I think but I'm but I'm asking like what do you think his real motive is like who's pushing him in favor of crime well I mean there's always the Soros boogy man um you how real is that it's it's real I I don't think one
52:13can ascribe everything to Soros I mean he's um and and George George himself is uh is I mean he's seen out at this point he's not yes not Compass mtis um so his his son Alex is in charge um and um but
52:31but there is this whole system that s built up over many decades um you know and uh so so I guess sorus and like-minded people whatever um you know they believe in open borders they
52:47they believe we shouldn't prosecute crime um this is insane the those seem like expressions of hatred toward the United States like I don't if I was pushing that on a country I would only do that if I hated the country and wanted to destroy it
53:03well it's anti civilizational I mean and sarus and similar and organizations have been pushing this in in Europe and other countries too yeah anyone who everywhere they can what's going on in Europe would you say Europe suddenly seems like a
53:18different place well um Ian my biggest concern for Europe is that the birth rate is half replacement rate yes so um Europe is rapidly
53:33becoming uh with each passing year um older and older with fewer and fewer young people um so I think at the at a most fundamental level unless Europe has birth rate at least roughly equal to
53:49replacement rate um it is uh in population preall population collapse is what's going on in Europe uh so um there's also like a shocking amount of censorship you may have seen like in uh you know Britain they're I
54:06kid you're not how can this be real they are releasing convicted pedophiles from prison in order to put people in prison for Facebook posts but to be fair those are posts that criticize the government so they
54:21have a good reason um well they actually some of these posts that I've at least the ones I've seen didn't actually criticize the government or or or they they they were they were seen as as sort of as as hate speech right um so because
54:39they noticed the society getting crappier and crappier with every year and they said so yeah um I mean there were and this is this I'm simply stating a fact there were um migrant rape gangs in in England
54:56that would gangs that would run around and prey on young girls gang rape them and some people found that objectionable which help say it should be objectionable um and uh they were upset
55:11about that and so they complained about it online and were sent to prison that sounds crazy so it is crazy and that's like
55:28like what well it is so it kind of gets to the I mean you're an engineer so you're it is mindboggling but it's the same you use the phrase mind virus but it it's behaving like a virus it's infecting people and making it
55:44impossible apparently for them to make rational deis what is that virus you know someone I think you should interview is uh God side uh I have oh you have yes oh I should watch that actually he's great yeah smart super smart guy yeah um and he uh he wrote a great book uh
56:04called um the parasitic mind yes a very good book highly recommend it yes um which where he tries to understand how did you get to this parasitic mind situation um and he's writing a book now which hopefully he'll publish soon um
56:20which is about suicidal empathy where you have so much empathy you're actually suiciding Society or so much perceived empathy uh it's not actually called shallow empathy not deep empathy deep empathy would be you'd want the society continue uh shallow empathy
56:36is is you have like empathy that's essentially skin deep and then you and and you don't it's but it's ultimately bad for civilization and results in the destruction of civilization um and God God side's got a good term for this suicidal empathy um
56:54so it it's going to sort of deconstruct what's what's you know where does this come come from um and uh yeah I mean part of it I suppose is is is sort of the decline of religion
57:11um so you know as the saying goes nature ofo a vacuum so when you have uh essentially decline in religion and increase in the secular nature of society
57:26for most people they need something to fill that void and so they adopt a religion it's not called a religion but like but effectively like woke the woke mind virus it's it's a it takes the place of religion yes um and they they they internalize it and they feel it
57:41with religious fervor yes uh so and rigidity yes yes and and they you know they essentially conduct like a holy war effectively uh it it's just not called a religion but it is a religion the sort of a work holy war um
58:00and and they're highly resistant to change as is normal for for for religions so um now for myself I'm I'm I sort of see myself as a sort of you know engineer
58:16physicist for me um I'm culturally Christian I grew up Christ I mean I was Anglican was baptized you know um uh I was went to Sunday School uh yeah um actually oddly enough I was sent to uh
58:32Hebrew preschool and angli Sunday school at the same time so it was h on Gila one day Jesus ELO the next which is you know if you're 5 years old it's fine there's no you know so um um but I'm I'm not Jewish it's just
58:48that my my father's two partners in his engineering firm were were I I they was went went to the same Hebrew preschool and and it was near our house so I just got sent there um and um so but but you
59:04know um I I I I I you I I I maybe this will make me even more Ames but I I I have trouble sort of believing all these stories uh these religious stories uh but obious lot of people do um and uh
59:22I respect people who want to have religious views I'm not trying to dissuade them from the religious views but uh uh anyway I'm just saying I I guess the the operating system I have is is is a sort of a physics engineering op operating system where I'm I I try to understand as much
59:38as possible possible about reality uh you know in in physics you're you're not supposed to believe everything anything absolutely you're supposed to question things that's how you discover new physics um you know in engineering that's how you discover if your machine
59:54will work or not work will the rocket get to or it well you know yeah um you know if you if your rocket is uh designed with your physics in mind uh correctly it will get to over it and if it is not it will not get to over it uh
1:00:10no matter what your belief system is you can believe um you know whe yeah um you it's like like I meet a lot of people speaking of La I meet a lot of people in La who believe witchcraft is
1:00:26and then you can do spells and that spells and witcraft Magic is real I'm like can you magic us to the moon and no one has yet been able to Magic us to the Moon um well spells can't be that good okay if you can't I want to go to the
1:00:42Moon let's go how about Mars and um we we got to the moon the first time we definitely went to the moon I swear yes we went to the moon we didn't go to the Moon we went to the moon several times right oh yeah I just want to check your view on that 100% went to the Moon I mean I I know
1:00:59in- depth the technical designs of the Rockets the spacecraft everything yes uh what went right what went wrong um and uh it it it was a remarkable piece of technology like incredible piece of technology for to go to the moon in '
1:01:1469 uh that that that was uh like reaching into the future and pulling the future forward uh dramatically um and and it was an important ideological B battle with Communism um because they couldn't put a
1:01:29post on the moon and capitalism could we did an interview a couple of weeks ago with a woman called Casey means she's a Stanford educated surgeon and really one of the most remarkable people I have ever met in the interview she explained
1:01:44how the food that we eat produced by huge food companies big food in conjunction with Pharma is destroying our health making this a weak and sick country the levels of chronic disease are beyond belief what Casey means who
1:02:01we've not stopped thought thinking about ever since is the co-founder of a healthcare technology company called levels and we are proud to announce today that we are partnering with levels and by proud I mean sincerely proud levels is a really interesting company
1:02:17and a great product it gives you insight into what's going on inside your body your metabolic Health it helps you understand how the food that you're eating the things that you're doing doing every single day or affecting your body in real time you put stuff in your mouth speaking for myself anyway and you
1:02:34don't think about it you have no idea what you're putting in your mouth and you have no idea what it's doing to your body but over time you feel weak and tired and Spacey and over an even longer period of time you can get really sick so it's worth knowing what the food you eat is doing to you the levels app works
1:02:51with something called a continuous glucose monitor a CGM you can get one is part of the planner you can bring your own it doesn't matter but the bottom line is Big Tech big Pharma and big food combined together to form an incredibly
1:03:06malevolent Force pumping you full of garbage unhealthy food with artificial sugars and hurting you and hurting the entire country so with levels you'll be able to see immediately what all this is doing to you you get access to real time personalized data and that's a critical
1:03:22step to changing your behavior those of us who like Oreos can tell you firstand hand this isn't talking to your doctor at annual physical looking backwards about things you did in the past this is up to the second information on how your body is responding to different foods
1:03:37and activities the things that give you stress your sleep etc etc it's easy to use it gives you powerful personalized Health Data then you can make much better choices about how you feel and over time it'll have a huge effect right now you can get an additional two free
1:03:53months when you go to levels. link SL Tucker that's levels. link Tucker this is the beginning of what we hope will be a long and happy partnership with levels and Dr Casey means do you believe there's a power higher than
1:04:09people yeah I mean I yeah I mean I think there's there's a lot we don't know uh we don't we don't know like like why does reality exist uh why
1:04:26where did it come from um where are the aliens um what questions should we ask that we don't even know to ask um
1:04:41so when you say what are the aliens what where are the aliens oh like why don't we see them a lot of people think we see aliens but I I've not seen any evidence of aliens um you know we've got 6,000 satellites in orbit and not one once have we had to maneuver around an alien
1:04:58spacecraft uh so um but on this Earth the US military has had to do a lot of maneuvering around objects they can't explain well unidentify fing objects for one thing but uh I mean there's always there's
1:05:13always a bunch of um classified programs that are underway uh that uh of new aircraft and new missiles and things so that that are classified even within the military so it's you know only you know the if you have the top secret
1:05:28compartmented clearance would you know about this new program so then you know some pilot sees something fast moving fast and says hey i s UFO I'm like yeah that was actually a new weapons program but we can't tell you
1:05:44that so but I I I if you can guarantee that the split second I see any evidence of aliens I will immediately post that on the xplatform and it'll probably be number one post of whole time that'll be your biggest day for sure um I mean but but
1:06:00to the question of a power beyond people beyond our Consciousness a Creator where are you on that well we must we might must have come from
1:06:15somewhere um so I guess you know that there must be some Creator or creative force or something that caused our exist existence to come into being what is the nature of that Creator
1:06:32um that I think is UN unknown at least I think it is it is there's to I I I I can't I I don't know of a definitive answer to that um so um but it sounds like you're open yes
1:06:50I I'm very open to you know I I I I'm I'm by Cur curiosity yes um and uh and trying to understand more about the nature of the universe so my my my driving philosophy is uh to understand
1:07:07the meaning of life or or really what questions to ask if the meaning of life the meaning of life is is is not the right question like as your dougas Adams made the point in the hitch is guide of the Galaxy that the like what is the meaning of life is
1:07:23probably not even the right question um so you know famously the in in that book the Earth was actually a computer to figure out the question answer to the question what is the meaning of life and then came up with the answer 42 um but
1:07:40then they're like what does that mean and it's like oh that's that that's the answer but the question is the really hard part you'll need a much bigger computer than Earth to figure that one out so so My Philosophy is that we should try to expand the scope and scale of consciousness we should try to have
1:07:56more humans more thinking uh and um and perhaps there there's an argument even for machine Consciousness um so let me just address those in order so the first is you say we need more people and not
1:08:12commit civilizational suicide it does seem like the US government if you take three steps back is pretty committed to making fewer Americans yeah there's a lot of anti- fertility propaganda a lot actually that seems like their main sort of domestic social policy is convincing
1:08:27you not to have kids what is that um I mean that's certainly part of civilizational suicide um the the the environmental movement in the extreme is fundamentally
1:08:43misanthropic and anti-human yes um they start seeing humans as a plague a blight on the surface of the Earth that if if that Earth would be this paradise if only the humans weren't here and some people actually have say this explicitly there's there there's the
1:08:59extinctionist society that literally they they the the this this guy who's the head of the extinctionist society was on the front page of the New York Times quoted as saying there are 8 billion people in the world it would be better if there were none so there's some people who actually
1:09:15say that explicitly which is is is completely insane he's advocating Holocaust world of humanity um to utter madness he should be condemned for such a statement but he wasn't for some reason uh now most people on the on the sort of uh
1:09:30environmental movement have that implicitly they're not they they don't realize that they have that as their optimization but but that is their actions uh head take us towards uh Extinction um
1:09:45so um a lot of people believe that the Earth can't sustain this level of human population which is utterly untrue um it may seem in a crowded City that there are a lot of people but actually if you look down on an airplane and you say
1:10:01look down am I over a person at any given point in time when you're an airplane the answer is 99.9% of the time no like If you flew from LA to New York and say you're you're drop is to drop a ball on someone and and hit them you would fail you have to drop a lot of
1:10:16balls you have to drop a lot of balls they could be insane so um all of the humans on Earth can fit on one floor in the city of New York yeah the cross-sectional area of of
1:10:31all humans 8 billion humans is small so we we have this uh totally wrong idea that uh the Earth is over over overpopulated where in fact it is
1:10:48underpopulated how do I mean have you ever heard a politician say anything like that are there how many there's there's maybe a few um prum politicians out there yeah I mean like um like Victor Oran Georg
1:11:03Maloney yes we're starting to see pro-natalist uh politicians um and hopefully more as time goes by um I think there's a guy that just got elected in the Czech Republic who's also Pro natalist um now
1:11:19these have to translate into actual actions that change the birth rate or it doesn't matter um and uh so far I've not seen any country Mak a meaningful dent in the both rate what would you do if you were in charge
1:11:34of natalist policy uh first of all I changed the education uh system so that people understand uh that you stop being taught that we're overpopulated this is
1:11:49completely false um a lot of it comes from this insane misanthropic book that Paul erck wrote the population bomb like 60 years ago yeah I hope he burns in hell that guy seriously um terrible human being total absolute Miss and Thro
1:12:05um and uh and say just look the the Earth can absolutely sustain its population it could we could double or triple the population um there's a professor I was talking to at Oxford um who who's his math says we could 10x the
1:12:21population without destroying the Amazon rainforest or anything terrible so um so I think we should expand the human population and increase the scope and scale of Consciousness so we can better understand uh the nature of this
1:12:37universe this wonderful Universe um and and all the amazing things that exist and and and so so that's one of the things I'd like we need to stop teaching people false propaganda that the Earth is overpopulated um I think we need to
1:12:56uh you know in especially with with the education of woman and man and is is we we need Stop scaring woman that having a kid destroys your life this is false you know we terrify girls
1:13:11into saying that if you get pregnant it's your life's over and this is this is what schools teach um now I agree we should not have teenage pregnancies yeah but but but um but actually having a child is one of the most delightful
1:13:27happiness inducing things you could possibly do of course of course um so um there's um there's also uh you know with
1:13:43um hormonal birth control I think uh maybe a lot of women are unaware that hormonal birth control causes depression um and and dramatically increases risk of suicide uh and changes uh their their
1:13:58preferences on who they want to um marry or have kids with uh it it changes their personality um and not does say this on the Box by the way caution may change your
1:14:15personality yes if the warnings are uh has significant cause significant risk of depression significant increase in suicide um and will make you want to go out with people that you don't actually
1:14:30like that's actually true by the way I know um I'm not saying that people shouldn't use birth control I think we should just be we shouldn't use I think hormonal birth control is is is making it's making a lot of women sad and depressed yes and they don't realize it
1:14:45and they don't realize that's the cause and and that you know there other forms of contraception that could be used and that we should they should just read the just read the label on the box is what I'm saying that was cons what you just said the warning label that was
1:15:00like the most taboo thing you could ever say for most of my life was to offer any criticism at all of hormonal birth control look I'm all I'm saying is read the warning label yeah fair but why the pressure not to read the warning label and just why are we giving it to 12-year-olds to regulate their acne
1:15:16right I I think we should give it to 12-year-olds uh like kid kids they don't know what's going on so it's like um now like there you know I think there there are other forms of birth control I think are have fewer negative
1:15:33uh effects um and than hormonal but but that's we should just be aware that that that uh this is not a riskless thing and it it does cause severe mood changes it does
1:15:49dramatically increase risk of suicide and depression um so so just FYI you know just make sure you that that that there's full disclosure here and you want all just read the warning label is
1:16:04all I'm saying just read you know and and consider maybe other options for birth control to any woman listening just just just read the warning label and consider other options um because the reason the reason
1:16:19you're sad might be the the the birth control the hormonal birth control that is fundamentally changing the hormones in your body in ways that probably are not good for you um and you I know women where where it they
1:16:35stopped taking birth control and their depression immediately disappeared so that's maybe worth a try but then you miss an opportunity maybe it's the bir control then you don't you don't get to go on ssris yeah yeah I think the esis are the
1:16:53devil what you don't they I so vehemently agree with you but I I guess I guess once you endorse Trump you can just say it all now right no I I think selective serona reup Inhibitors are uh zombify people um and and change their
1:17:10personality and make them not who they are terrible they're so common yes I I I think we should revisit whether this is this is actually good this I just agree with you the ssris are
1:17:26like I'm not saying we should that no one should ever be subscribed ssris but giving them out like candy is uh crazy you look at like sort of uh anti-depressant prescriptions in the United States versus other countries and we're like
1:17:42way above everyone else oh yeah I have seen many many times in my life in the news business after a mass shooting like school for example yeah someone will say well what meds was the shooter on oh yeah EXA and immediately be shouted down as a crazy person as a
1:17:59you know Bobby Kennedy level wacko yes who should himself be institutionalized for even raising the question I've always wonder like why wouldn't we want to know what meds AB want to know what meds are on now now sometimes it's perhaps they were on because there like some people do I I
1:18:16you know I don't say it's like all one way or all the other of um I me there are there are people that have fundamental chemical imbalances in their brain if they don't take uh medication to control for example uh paranoid schizophrenia they will have paranoid
1:18:33schizophrenia for sure um and uh and and I know many cases where people stop taking their you know meds and uh and and lost their mind oh yeah uh and uh and then try to try to keep kill people and stuff like that so it's or
1:18:49themselves well the guy with the ax on Market Street probably should be on meds that guy should we should try it yeah it make you know does he want to a motor more or less on a given Med uh you know um so so there are psychiatric
1:19:06medications that I that with with a good outw V I'm not saying that that doesn't exist uh but we overprescribe psychiatric medication in the United States obviously uh far in excess of any other country like you know way more than Canada or Britain or Japan or any
1:19:24China anywhere it's like we're off the charts on on psychiatric uh medication prescriptions in the US why why don't people raise that point more often I wonder in public I should I'm I'm raising it yeah you are you said that um are artificial
1:19:41intelligence machine intelligence um might be a good thing where where are we on AI right now AGI right now and what are your views
1:19:57well I think at this point it's obvious to everyone that AI is advancing at a very rapid Pace yes um you can see it with the new capabilities that come out every month or every every week sometimes
1:20:13um you know you AI at this point can write a better essay than probably 90% maybe 95% of all humans say write an essay on any given subject um AI right now can can beat the vast majority of
1:20:31humans um uh if you say draw an image draw a picture um it can draw like um if you try to say mid mid Journey which is the Aesthetics of mid Journey are incredible um it will
1:20:47draw it will create incredible images uh that are better than again like 90% of artists it's just objectively the case and it'll do it immediately like 30 seconds later
1:21:02um we're also starting to see uh AI movies so you start seeing you know short films with AI um AI Music Creation
1:21:17um and the the the rate at which we're increasing AI compute is exponential hyper exponential so this dramatically more AI compute coming on online every every month um you know there seems to be
1:21:36roughly I don't know the the amount of AI Compu coming online is increasing at like I a quote roughly 500% a year and like it's like that's likely to continue for several years um the and then the sophistication of
1:21:53the AI algorith is also improving so bringing online a massive amount of AI compute and also improving the efficiency of the computer and and what and like what what the AI software can
1:22:08do so it's it's it's quantitative and qualitative in Improvement um so the you know I I might I think next year we you'll be be able to ask AI so certainly by the end of next year make a short movie about something or
1:22:24you know probably can do at least a 15minute you know show or something like that um so yeah it's advancing very rapidly
1:22:42um my top concern for AI safety is that we need to have a maximally truth seeking AI uh so the this is the most important thing for AI safety in my opinion
1:23:00um you know the the central lesson that say oy clar was trying to convey in 2001 Space Odyssey was that you shouldn't Force AI to lie um so in that book
1:23:16the um the the AI was told to take the astronauts to the monolith but they also could not know about the monolith it resulted that uh quandry by killing them and taking them to the monolith or didn't kill all of them killed most of them that's why H
1:23:34hell would not open the pod bay doors right um so uh very important to have trth seeking AIS now and what what I actually see with the AI that are
1:23:49being developed is that they're being programmed with the work mind virus um so the lying is big taked in yes um and we saw this on display very clearly with the release of Google Gemini yes uh where you would ask for a
1:24:07picture of the founding fathers of the United States um and it would show a group of diverse women in you know dressed in in with sort of 18th century God pow powdered wigs but from St
1:24:22Lucia yeah I mean like look if I understand if you say like show me a group of people for sure if and it shows a group of divorce women that's totally fine but if you say this if you say very specifically the the founding follows of the United States which were you know
1:24:37group of white dudes then you should show them like and and with and and what they actually look like because you've asked for something which is a fact from history um but it didn't uh it was it
1:24:52was programmed with the work mind virus so so much that it it actually even though it knew the truth it it It produced a lie um now of course then then people really started playing with it and said okay now now show me a group of fafen ss officers in World War II
1:25:09turns out they were also a group of divorce woman according to Gemini all the black Nazi ladies yeah it's it's like wow I didn't realize that you know it's not what I expected um so you know Well's also not what happened happened
1:25:24it's not what happened so it's just it the AI is is producing a lie um and um and then you know then like one of the questions that people that people asked was like which
1:25:40is worst uh Global thow nuclear war or misgendering Caitlyn Jenner and said misgendering Caitlyn Jenner is worse now Caitlyn Jenna kill kills fewer people yeah to Caitlyn Jenna to her credit I said no please misgender me
1:25:55that is far more preferable than World War global thermonuclear war we all die but but to have a you know a production release AI say stuff like that is concerning um because if if
1:26:11let's say this becomes like all powerful and and it still has this programming um where misgendering is worse than nuclear war well it could conclude that the way to ensure that the there can never be any misgendering is to eliminate all
1:26:27humans now Pro if like optimization is probability of misgendering is zero no no humans no misgendering problem solved now we're back to arthy claric who's exactly pretty preent
1:26:42yes so that's why I think the most important thing is to have a maximally truth seeking AI That's why I saw it xai and that's our goal with grock um no people will
1:26:58point out cases where Gro gets it wrong but we try to correct it as quickly as possible but maybe even a bigger problem is that when you make decisions that affect people you want those decisions to be informed by love of people yeah
1:27:13and machines are incapable of Love yeah I mean there they they certainly okay they're capable of you can program a machine to be philanthropic rather than
1:27:30misanthropic yes um but don't don't instincts shape decisions particularly decisions you can't plan for I mean if I ask you you know a question about one of your children every answer you give is
1:27:45going to be shaped by your love for that child and that's why know that that's what makes us decent parents in the end is that that instinct which is love and if a machine has any power over us without that animating Instinct won't it def by definition hurt
1:28:09us yeah well whether I mean I don't know it we should certainly aspire to program the AI philanthropically not M anthropically yes um and to have like said we wanted to be truthful
1:28:25and Cur curious and to Foster Humanity into the future um and uh yeah that's what we want obviously is there any way I guess to set limits on the decisions that machines can make
1:28:40that affect human lives and make certain that there's some trigger in the system that inserts a human being into the decisionmaking process
1:29:00well the look The the reality of what's Happening whether one likes it or not um is that we we're building super intelligent AIS hyper like hyper intelligent like
1:29:16intelligent more intelligent than we can comprehend yes um so I'd like this to like let's say you have a child that is a Super Genius child that that you know it's going to be much smarter than you then well what
1:29:31can you do you you can instill good values in how you raise that child so even though you know it's going to be far smarter than you um you can make sure it's got good values philanthropic values um good morals you know honest uh you
1:29:50know productive that kind of thing controlling at the end of the day I I don't know if I don't think we'll be able to control it uh so I think the best we can do is make sure it grows up well you've been saying that for a long time yes I've been saying for a long
1:30:05time yes are you still as worried about it as you seem to be two years ago when I asked you about it well I I think
1:30:20that like my guess is like look it's it's it's 80% likely to be good maybe 90 um so you could look think of the glass as 80% full
1:30:35um it's probably going to be it's probably going to be great the some chance of annihilation and you say the chance of annihilation is 20% 10 to 20% something like that how concerned is Sam Alman about Annihilation do you
1:30:52think I think in reality is not concerned about it I don't trust open AI I mean I you know I started that company as a nonprofit open source yes the open and open AI I named the compan I named the company yeah open AI as an
1:31:08open source um and it is uh now extremely closed source and and Ma and maximizing profit so does risk I don't understand how you actually go from being a an open
1:31:23source nonprofit profit to a close source for maximum profit organization I'm missing well but Sam Alman got rich didn't he at various points he's claimed not to be getting rich but he's claimed many things that were false um
1:31:40and now apparently he's going to get10 billion a stock or something like that so um I don't trust samman and I and I don't think we want to have the most powerful AI in the world controlled by someone who is not
1:31:56trustworthy and sorry I just don't I mean but that that seems like a fair concern yeah but but you don't think as someone who knows him and has dealt with him that he is worried about the possibility this could get out of control and hurt people he will say those
1:32:13words yeah but no if AI did if it became clear to the rest of us that it was out of control and posed a threat to humanity would there be any way to stop
1:32:34it I hope so um I mean if you have multiple AIS and ones that are hopefully you have
1:32:51the AIS that are pro-human be stronger them the AIS that are not Battle of the AIS yeah
1:33:09yeah I mean that that is how it is with say chess these days the the um like the AI chess program is also are vastly better than any human um
1:33:26incomprehensibly better meaning like we can't even understand why it made that move good right we don't even know why it made the it'll make a move we don't know why it made the move um so and in fact some of the moves will seem like blunders but then turn out to
1:33:43Checkmate um so you know for for a while there there was there was some the best human chest players with the best computers could beat just a computer and then it got to the point
1:33:59where if you added a human it just made everything worse and then it was just AI it's just computer programs versus computer programs um that's that's where things are headed
1:34:16in general what I mean sweet dreams um at what point so I don't know I think we just got to make like I said make sure we instill good values in the AI
1:34:32what's everyone going to do for a living I mean in a benign AI scenario that is probably the biggest challenge is how do you find meaning if AI is better than you at everything yeah um
1:34:49that's the benign scenario that's the good news well yeah I been of I guess you know for a lot of people like the idea of retiring and you know um really are you looking forward to it no not mean I I'd like to hope I'd
1:35:05like to think that I I'd like to be do useful things um don't you think it's a universal desire it's it's it's not it's not Universal in that there are certainly I know many people who prefer to be
1:35:21retired that they prefer to um sort of have not have responsibilities and engage in in leisure activities
1:35:36so I we and we're on the cusp of of this is it's really a remarkable time to exist um well I'll tell you like one of the ways I I sort of was able to sort of sleep and Rec reconcile myself
1:35:52to um to this is that I I thought well would I prefer to be alive and see the Advent of digital super intelligence or would I would I prefer to be alive at a different time and not
1:36:08see it and I guess I'm like well I guess I'd prefer to be alive to see if it's going to happen I prefer to be alive to see it happen out of curiosity um and then like well let's
1:36:24say you knew for sure it would uh kill everyone would you you you could now now you can shift back in time like I guess I'd want to be near the end of my life or something
1:36:39before that happened but I at at the end of it's like if um if it's going to happen uh and there's nothing you do about it hypothetically would you prefer to see it or not see it and I guess I I guess
1:36:54it's going to happen I prefer to see it rather not see it um yeah but as a man of action why not convince Trump to make you Secretary of Defense and then just nuke
1:37:14AI um I I I I think I I would certainly push for a having some some kind of regulatory body that at least has insight into what uh these companies are doing and Can Ring the Alarm Bell even
1:37:31if we don't have a regulation or rule so I'm not I'm not someone who wants to get rid of all regulatory agencies or everything I think think we' there's the right number of regulations right number of regulators and we've gone we've gone too far just like if you in a football game
1:37:47if you had too many referees on the field it would be weird like you can't throw the pass because you hit a referee ex then there too many referees um so uh but but no but if you like say look at any pro sports game um they all have referees that like the teams could
1:38:03decide we're going to have game we're going to not have referees that could be a thing but but every sports game they have refs to make sure that the rules are followed and um and it's it's a better game if if you have well we have cops too yeah yeah exactly cops are the
1:38:18referees so uh I think we for for something that is a a danger to the public or potential danger to the public we we have referees we have Regulators you know so um like
1:38:34the FDA and the FAA and you know these various Regulatory Agencies they were they were established because aircraft were falling out of the sky and and some manufacturers were not you know building high quality aircraft
1:38:49they're cutting corners and then people will die um and uh you know for Food and Drugs that some manufacturers were making lowquality drugs and so they that they're they're lying to people so
1:39:04saying that something cured them when it killed them um so FDA to you know Regulators to referees to try to uh make you make sure that this those uh drug manufactures are truthful now I do think
1:39:19it mostly works I mean I think it's doesn't mean don't need regory form we do reform we do but um I don't think we should have no Regulators in AI given that it's potential existential RIS a little weird that everything is
1:39:35regulated yeah I mean you said you're being sued by the Department of Justice for not hiring more Asylum Seekers for your high-tech company yeah even though it's legal for us to hire Asylum Seekers right so um so they're watching everything regulating everything
1:39:50controlling everything including our thoughts right that's why they opposed to free speech but they're not meaningfully regulating AI which will eliminate like the purpose for most people's lives and could kill us all it's a little weird yeah I think we should have some why don't we something
1:40:06above nothing in that range yeah but why don't we I don't know um you know I I all the way back like I
1:40:21like during the Obama presidency um I I I you know met with the many times but usually in like group settings um the the one one-on-one meeting I had with AAL in the Oval Office I said look the one thing that we really need to do is
1:40:37is set up an at the beginnings of an AI regulatory agency and it can start with Insight where you don't you don't just come shooting from the hip throwing out regulations you just start with Insight where the the AI regulatory committee
1:40:54uh simply goes into to understand what all the companies are doing insight and then proposes rules that all the AI companies agree to follow just like you know sports teams in the NFL you know you have proposed rules for
1:41:09football that everyone agrees to follow um that make the game better you know so that that's the way to do it um but nothing came of it what did he say when he said that to him I mean he seems like kind of agree but but also people
1:41:26didn't realize what what the where AI was headed that at that time you know so AI seemed like some super futuristic yeah for sci-fi basically so like I'm telling you this is going to be smarter than the smartest human and
1:41:44um my predictions are coming absolutely true and uh so we need to have some insight here just to make make sure that this companies aren't cutting Corners um doing dangerous things
1:41:59um but go Google kind of controlled the the White House at that time and and they they they did not want any regulatory well that's it I mean you never see politicians turn down opportunities to become more powerful which is the point of Regulation it makes them more powerful
1:42:14yeah so it sounds like regulatory capture then well yeah um I mean the CIO the the Ys at the time was ex Google person so um they they put
1:42:30the brakes on any AI regulation um and we still don't have any AI regulation at the federal level it's amazing so I I think we should have something above nothing um like I said at least
1:42:47Insight where even even if there's no there's no rule that's being break broken they can at least say hey we we have insight into what this company are doing or that company is doing and we're concerned that would be helpful to know yeah instead politically motivated Liars
1:43:03are in charge of the future it seems a little yeah sketchy last question you you really kind of pulled out a lot of stops to help Trump you're on stage yesterday if he gets elected will you continue to help him yeah now absolutely so well we've talked about um kind of a
1:43:21government efficiency commission or the department of government efficiency which is a funny what what per sorry I'm just laughing I love it you managed to make it sound a little C or government efficiency what percentage of Google
1:43:37employees did you can when you got there you mean Twitter rather I beg sorry I just you just been talking about Google Twitter yeah yeah um well we we we're about 80%
1:43:53and and and we've we've actually um improved the features and functionality of the site more in you the past year and a half than the last I don't know eight years with 20% of the staff so just for I just want to throw
1:44:09that for context so you've talked to Trump about yeah some kind ofion yeah which he's he has mentioned publicly several times uh and he's very supportive of having some kind of you know government
1:44:25efficiency commission uh call a department of government efficiency Doge um I kind like those it's more it's more fun um yeah uh and uh we just take a look at at at all the federal agencies
1:44:41and say do we really need whatever it is 428 federal agencies like there's so many that people never even heard of or and that have overlapping areas of responsibility we should I don't know probably we should get I mean there there are more federal agencies than there are years
1:44:58since the establishment of the United States which means that we've created more than one Federal agency per year on average that seems a lot that's a lot that's a lot uh so we should have that seems crazy
1:45:13um I think we should be able to get away with uh 99 agencies I don't know that seems a lot like a lot of agencies it's a lot yeah yeah um two that's yeah exactly uh we should have fewer agencies um and uh and they certainly shouldn't
1:45:30have overlapping responsibilities um and and then we need some kind of we just need a review of regulations to say which ones are sensible and which ones are not um because if you've got Regulators every year they're going to add more
1:45:45regulations it's just automatic like like they're just output regulations um and and then and there's more laws and regulations every year until basically everything's legal um so we can't get anything done so we need some kind of garbage collection for regulations that don't make
1:46:00sense I think I'm saying very obvious things you're you are saying obvious things yeah so which will be very unpopular things yeah um I'll probably need if this happens a quite a significant security team um
1:46:17so that because someone might literally go post on me from the post office but in the meantime you've got America pack yeah that is encouraging voting for the next month am I summarizing correctly uh yeah I I me a formed America pack um really support
1:46:34core values that I believe in uh which are I think again very obvious Centrist uh positions which is like we in America I think we want safe cities uh secure borders uh sensible
1:46:50spending tell me where I'm going far right here um uh you know we want to uh have the right to self- protection um we we should respect the Constitution and not try to break the
1:47:05Constitution it's therefore reason um and um you know we we should stop lawfare um I kind of listed these out these are all listed on the America Pac website people can go look at the
1:47:20America Pac website uh it's the America pack .org and see if there's anything I disagree with um or perhaps we should modify these goals but I think these are good goals to have they uh they were certainly part of
1:47:35the oh and right to free speech uh you know uh First Amendment um if we don't have free speech we don't have democracy because people cannot make an informed vote uh so those are my
1:47:53controversial views and you know and and look I I I don't think either party I don't think the Republicans are perfect I don't think obviously right now I more Republican than Democrat but it's not
1:48:08like I think the Republican party is perfect or or it's without issues um but we've got a choice between two candidates and I think on balance it's a no-brainer uh to vote for Trump and if we don't vote for Trump I think we are
1:48:24at Ser serious risk of losing our democracy and becoming a one-party state where um there isn't an election anymore there's only a Democratic primary like there is in California Ela musk thank you very much welcome